forward. host: let's go to our first phone call. a democrat caller in detroit, michigan. caller: we are 2.3 in gross national product and we have a 5.1 g.d.p. growth rate. since 1975, which was the last year that we had a trade surplus -- policies through the w.t.o., nafta, most favored trading status and oil exploration. i heard that 50,000 plants are lost to foreign competition. the question is how come no one noticed when it was 3,000? guest: those are two good and interesting points for debate. the first relates to the sovreignty issue, how does w.t.o. affect sovreignty and second of all the trade deficit. on the sovreignty issue, opponents argue that sovereign decisions by countries can be affected but the point i made earlier which is whatever the w.t.o. does and member country in terms of arbitration saying you are breaking the rules, a member country can say i choose not to. they can always choose not to, which is an important point to make. on the trade deficit, there is an issue that the u.s. has seen its trade increase and deficits increase with china since they joined in 2001.